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Old 03/12/2012, 11:17 AM   #1
crxh22honda
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Default t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

ok so Ive been thinking alot about this. Ive wanted to switch to a b series transmission. but i really would not like cutting into my hood. an also how much money i would have to spend on buying a good b16 transmission an the h2b kit, how much a new down pipe would be, new clutch an new flywheel, an engine mount. Than you still have a used transmission in your car. An i already have at2t4 trans,action stage 3 brand clutch and Bisimoto flywheel, an already have new engine mounts for a h series.

so i figure i would start researching a final drive. well i found one at mfactory. they offer a 5.15 final drive for h series. an also 4.64

i got on there calculator an found this out.

stock t2t4
rpm 8400
At
final drive 4.266

1st Gear: 3.285 Max MPH: 42
2nd Gear: 1.956 Max MPH: 70 Shift Point: 5024
3rd Gear: 1.344 Max MPH: 102 Shift Point: 5753
4th Gear: 1.034 Max MPH: 133 Shift Point: 6449
5th Gear: .787 Max MPH: 175 Shift Point: 6401

5th gear 70mph 3200

b16a2/b16b

Just for comparing purposes

rpm 8400

final gear 4.4

1st Gear: 3.23 Max MPH: 41
2nd Gear: 2.105 Max MPH: 63 Shift Point: 5443
3rd Gear: 1.458 Max MPH: 91 Shift Point: 5793
4th Gear: 1.107 Max MPH: 120 Shift Point: 6354
5th Gear: .848 Max MPH: 157 Shift Point: 6418


at 70 mph 3650rpm 5th gear

now what im wanting to do but i havnt seen anyone else who has switched the fourth gear out before, ive seen the fifth gear done and thats what im hoping to find out if someone knows that you can swap the fourth gear out as well as the fifth. an still using the m factory 5.15 final gear. my gut is telling me you can but im not sure. if it would work out the this is what the specs would be.


T2t4 with 5.15 final m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth.


1st Gear: 3.285 Max MPH: 35
2nd Gear: 1.956 Max MPH: 58 Shift Point: 5054
3rd Gear: 1.344 Max MPH: 85 Shift Point: 5755
4th Gear: .966 Max MPH: 118 Shift Point: 6062 stock 1.034 110mph shift 6488
5th Gear: .757 Max MPH: 150 Shift Point: 6147 stock .787 145mph shift 6391
stock @ 70mph 5th rpm 4050

at 70mph in 5th gear rpm 3700

an if anyone has accord f22a1 transmission for cheap i would really like that to. it has a .710 fifth gear. Which would be 160mph max an 70mph @ 3600 an this also has been done in h series trans

i think the best transmission set up would be this for me. cause if i do a 100 shot an with my build i think ill be faster than 110mph an if i had to an my build should be able to hold it bring it to 9,000rpm max speed in fourth would be 126mph.

but one thing that worries me is the shift points. That fourth gear gets dropped a little bit more. But I think It should still be at a very good spot in my power curve.

an also doing all this i'll be putting in new Synchros so the tranny will be fresh.
which i dont know to much about synchros to. an if anyone has any info on carbon synchros or any other kind that i should know about please let me know.


so if anyone has some good thoughts or im just way the fuck off tell me. i dont think i am. but just tell me




here is the master code and ratio listing for h series

http://honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2548441

here is the calculator i used

http://www.teammfactory.com/gear-calculator



im not saying this will work at all but i wanna find out an will do it if i find out it can work. but i just wanted to get my thoughts out an info lol

Last edited by crxh22honda; 03/13/2012 at 04:33 AM.
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Old 03/12/2012, 04:08 PM   #2
H22APWRD94
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

The best way to determine if 4th would work for you is actually getting an H23 trans and measuring the mainshaft and countershaft 4th gear parts and comparing them to the parts for the SiR-T trans. If they are the same dimensionally (bearing surface inside, synchro surface, height when mounted on shaft, dog engagement space) it would be a direct swap. It is not one that I have done before personally. If everything plays nicely together, it would be a pretty straightforward build. Overall, you getting through the traps near the top of 4th gear is going to be dependent on slick size, overall power level, trans gearing and rev limit. You are on the right track for all of those ideas. You want to build your transmission around your power curve. Get your shift points where you will have more area under the curve, but not to the point where the gear is too long.

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Old 03/12/2012, 04:29 PM   #3
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

Hey do you know anything about carbon Synchros. Is there something I need to know about them. Like if its just that they last longer an made stronger. Or shift harder. I have no clue.

An do you still do Tranny work? Do you happen to have a h23 Tranny around?

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Old 03/12/2012, 09:53 PM   #4
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

Carbon synchros are coated on the inside for easier movement along the face surface to make engaement quicker and hopefully smoother. If the dogs on the gear or slider are worn though, carbon synchros will not make a bit of difference.

I am still doing transmission work.

I have no H transmissions laying around.

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Old 03/13/2012, 11:26 AM   #5
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

Sweet thanks i sent you a pm asking if you would be willing to put it together for me

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Old 03/13/2012, 01:04 PM   #6
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

well I called factory about this. They said yes the h23 gears will fit t2t4 but the final drive will not work with the t2t4 transmission. Because they are 12bolt lsd. So ill have to buy a after market lsd if i want one. Which are I guess a 10bolt. Is there other good lsd out there besides quaife those guys want 980 dollars for a lsd.

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Old 03/13/2012, 06:15 PM   #7
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

MFactory. AWESOME LSD.

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Old 03/14/2012, 02:36 AM   #8
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

Lol so a few hours later mfactory called me back n it was a different guy. An said sorry but they guy you talk to gave you the wrong information. H22 an f series are interchangeable no problem. But not h23. For the h23 fifth you would have to modify cause it's to tall......so now I have to research more Eeeerrrr lol.

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Old 03/14/2012, 04:07 AM   #9
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

Ok so this is what I got.

Stock h22 four gear(1.034) with 5.15 gear at 8400 with 23.05 size tires = 110mph

So if i do a 50-100shot shit even if with make 280hp 205tq before nitrous (that's my goal could be higher just don't want to over guess) I think I might be able to 110mph n could need more room to play. (If I'm wrong about that please tell me, I busted out a 104mph with my stock set up, an 185/65r14 fusion hzi)

So if i could go with a bigger tire like 24.5 slick but Idk the down falls of that beside getting more MPH which if i brought my rpms to 9,000 which I think it should be able to handle but it sounds just bad right? But I would hit 126mph at my Max.

An my shift point would be 69**rpms if i went with a stock fourth.

But if i went with a the f series fourth gear. 933 final drive 5.15 23.05in tire 8400=120mph but my shift point would be 59**rpms an Idk if that is to low or not. So I'm really lost now. Any ideas would help

Oo an the f series f22b 5th gear would have a Max speed of this set 175mph... 70mph @ 3500rpm

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Old 03/14/2012, 09:43 AM   #10
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

fuck i heard him wrong h23 an f series parts will work together. h22 wont fit either really except the fifth you can get worked on it will work.

but it sounds like a 5.15 is not the way togo in drag racing cause the teeth get to be so small an at the launch they can break. so he told me to stick with the 4.64. the 5.1 final is more for road racing.

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Old 03/14/2012, 12:45 PM   #11
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

holy crap?? all this to figure it out ??? s80 DELTE THREAD!!!!

people don,t do h2b's solely just because the gearing, its, also the weight ( not much, but some)
more common trans, stonger/stouter trans, bigger aftermarket support.. etc !! so this being said. why spend 2k on a h trans that still has weaker internal parts than a b series. sure, u might had good snychro's and a lsd, but so did my buddy who went threw 6-7 h trannies in 1 year... granted he had a sleeved motor with 680 some odd h.p.


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Old 03/14/2012, 03:45 PM   #12
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

This is where it gets tough. Yes, the H22 trans on a 23" tire with your taller FD will get you where you want to go. Moving up to a 24.5 tire would not really be necessary unless you are planning to go a lot faster, as the taller FD ratio will kill your 4th gear acceleration. The biggest gear change of yours that I would be worried about is that 1-2 change. Lot of RPM difference, and really depends on a good power curve to get over that.

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Old 03/14/2012, 05:04 PM   #13
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

yea i was worried about that to. but i think i'm gonna go with. the 4.64 final gear. an carbon Synchros.1/2/3/4. and 23in slicks.

final drive 4.64

rpm 8400

tires 23in

1st gear 3.285 mph 38
2nd gear 1.56 mph 63 shift point 5038
3rd gear 1.345 mph 92 shift point 5739
4th gear 1.034 mph 120 shift point 6448
5th gear .787 mph 157 shift point 6401



at 70mph 5th 3600rpm



i also found out that t2t4 has a helical lsd an not a viscous lsd.(which i guess h22 lsd is viscous an if i would of had that one i would not be able to do with out getting a new lsd an some other parts to make it work. so i lucked out) allows me to keep my stock lsd. so less money. i'm buying these part through jbmotorsports which they are having a sale on them right now.

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Old 03/14/2012, 08:06 PM   #14
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

Quote:
Originally Posted by H22APWRD94 View Post
MFactory. AWESOME LSD.
i have a mfactory in my h22a transmission and the thing is amazing, super smooth, no noise turns like stock but puts the power to the ground! Id recommend mfactory any day

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Old 03/16/2012, 04:59 AM   #15
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

So wait what do you have of mfactory? That's just a brand

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Old 03/16/2012, 12:19 PM   #16
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

I am guessing an LSD since he quoted my post.

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Old 03/17/2012, 05:53 AM   #17
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

Are you needing an entire H23 trans or just the gears??


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Old 03/30/2012, 04:37 AM   #18
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

I was thinking the whole Tranny at the time burning just gonna stick with what I have since now I have a 4.64 final drive instead of going with the 5.15. Cause that's when I would really be in so trouble if I had to drive on the high way for a bit.

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Old 04/02/2012, 02:38 AM   #19
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

I think your choice of going with the 4.64 final drive was a good decision to make given that you're buying this without knowing what your power curve looks like. Now if you had the motor all assembled and had a power curve to go off of then you could really go into detail with your ratios.


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Old 04/27/2012, 02:05 PM   #20
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

Order a jdm M2B4 LSD trans there strong and reliable and the 4th and 5th gears r short but the others r a lil longer so just switch out 2nd and 3rd with shorter gears out of another f or h series trans my fifth gear at 70 is at 3800 rpm

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Old 04/27/2012, 06:13 PM   #21
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Default Re: t2t4(accord sir-T) with m2k4 (h23) fourth an fifth gear with 5.15final

Well the Tranny you bought is the same as t2t4 as far as gear ratio go. But with one big difference. The t2t4 has a helical lsd. An m2b4 has viscous lsd. Like I said before. Which means you won't be able to switch out final drives. Or ever switch out lsd with out other work being like changing the caseing. Saying it stronger than a h22 Tranny would be wrong. With that Tranny you won't be able to switch out any gears that would help you. Ur kinda stuck with what you have.

http://honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2548441

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